Curse

Stupid Shizno · Jan 02, 2007, 08:11 PM // 20:11

@jsummers

because anyone that wants to get fame/rank/win halls goes to international districts. because of this, all the american players that join groups often represent europe since the leader or 3/6 of the group is european. so the 2 americans in the group will represent europe. thats why america "represented teams" often look like crap.

dunky_g · Jan 02, 2007, 08:12 PM // 20:12

tbh all ur doing is whining, y dont you go try and win halls and then you can go to fow off your own back, stop complaing about what other people do and do it yourself if u think its that simple..

jsumners · Jan 02, 2007, 08:14 PM // 20:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stupid Shizno

@jsummers

because anyone that wants to get fame/rank/win halls goes to international districts. because of this, all the american players that join groups often represent europe since the leader or 3/6 of the group is european. so the 2 americans in the group will represent europe. thats why america "represented teams" often look like crap.

Well, that is clearly part of the problem. If your group starts from an International District, then it shouldn't have any bearing on which region controls the Hall. In fact, I would say the International Districts shouldn't even be available there. That's just plain stupid.

aubray1741 · Jan 02, 2007, 08:22 PM // 20:22

Do you smell that? Smells like hypocrisy!

Winstar · Jan 02, 2007, 08:22 PM // 20:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsumners

Why would I look at the ladder? As I've said, I don't play PvP that much. If PvP were my main concern in the game then I would pay attention to the ladder. As it is, I like to do missions, quests, and challenging areas with my guildmates/friends. Aside from not wanting to play for the European region, being the American that I am, I would have to convince at least my guild to all convert to Europe so we wouldn't have to deal with International Districts. ("Meet me in Lion's Arch district 1". "Where are you?" "Right beside storage." "I don't see you." "Dammit, I'm in the International District.")

If the American PvPers can only hold the area in question for a short time during peak play times, then yes, they suck. It isn't that hard of a conclusion to reach. They have a good run every now and then, but then they loose almost immediately. And yes, their poor performance does affect my game. I've outlined it plenty. And the post I originally linked to outlines it even more; from the perspective of the side that constantly holds the Hall.

The reason you would look at the ladder is if you wanted to understand the situation and why it is that Euro holds halls more frequently. As Tony and others said there are simply more Euro players and its partially a matter of numbers. That said I do agree with the general point.

I've not paid too much attention but in the not too distant past america used to get favor around 9 est and hold from that point for quite a while. From what has been said it seems like its gotten worse which is too bad. Though I'm a pvp player mainly, I do actually agree that the system is a little unfair for American pve players at the time being and for Euro players in the past. Ideally each district would simply end up holding during the hours you would expect them to but that doesn't seem to be the case. While it might seem to be an interesting idea to have the pvp realm affect the pve realm and that its part of the ethos of the game in some strange way it would seem absurd if it were the other way around. I know I'd be pissed if I ended up with some kind of disadvantage in PvP because of something that went on in PvE. But why in princinple should PvE players have to put up with this when PvP players never would? As much as I like PvP more than PvE I don't think there is something fundamentally more important about PvP players than PvE players. It is, in the end, a game for everyone and we all just want to enjoy it. If you want to maintain some kind of tie between the 2 facets of GW in this regard, it should be less important. Make it so that the region holding gets some bonus in the elite areas like extra chests, automatic shrine like bonuses etc.

Stupid Shizno · Jan 02, 2007, 08:23 PM // 20:23

@jsummers

international district should be allowed? please son

the whole aspect of guild wars is to play with anyone anywhere in the world, we have no relms like wow. the international district is a zone just so you can play with anyone you want. stop whining please. i was trying to be nice but now your just being arrogant.

nightshade_eyes · Jan 02, 2007, 08:36 PM // 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stupid Shizno

@jsummers

because anyone that wants to get fame/rank/win halls goes to international districts. because of this, all the american players that join groups often represent europe since the leader or 3/6 of the group is european. so the 2 americans in the group will represent europe. thats why america "represented teams" often look like crap.

Mixed region team wins in HoH should be counted towards opening up FoW/UW in the INT districts.

AD1-2 is just so bad in terms of player quality.

jsumners · Jan 02, 2007, 08:38 PM // 20:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stupid Shizno

@jsummers

international district should be allowed? please son

the whole aspect of guild wars is to play with anyone anywhere in the world, we have no relms like wow. the international district is a zone just so you can play with anyone you want. stop whining please. i was trying to be nice but now your just being arrogant.

No, you're missing the point and not understanding what I wrote. I said the International District should not be allowed in the Hall of Heroes if it works the way you said it does. If a party of 3 Europe, 2 America, and 1 Japan can win favor for Europe simply because there were more Europe players in the group, well, that's stupid. It shouldn't be allowed to happen. If the Hall of Heroes is going to determine PvE benefits for a whole region, then that region's PvP players should be forced to play for that region alone.

The solution here isn't "quit playing PvE and learn how to play PvP so your region can gain favor." The solution is to fix the broken favor system.

jsumners · Jan 02, 2007, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by nightshade_eyes

Mixed region team wins in HoH should be counted towards opening up FoW/UW in the INT districts.

AD1-2 is just so bad in terms of player quality.

That is also a good solution.

Stupid Shizno · Jan 02, 2007, 08:40 PM // 20:40

there is no fow/uw in INT districts buddy, go try to form a guild in an ID district, you cant . you need a region. thats why there is no guild register in IND districts, no favor in IND districts. if there was IND favor then everyone would just hang out in IND ToA....just get use to the fact america is on the short end of the stick, the first 6 months of GW american ruled favor, now they probably quit since HA is a joke and euro is picking up the slack

Vinraith · Jan 02, 2007, 08:42 PM // 20:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by nightshade_eyes

Mixed region team wins in HoH should be counted towards opening up FoW/UW in the INT districts.

Yup, that just makes sense.

Stupid Shizno · Jan 02, 2007, 08:42 PM // 20:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsumners

The solution here isn't "quit playing PvE and learn how to play PvP so your region can gain favor." The solution is to fix the broken favor system.

um, thats exactly what arena net had in mind when they made the game im pretty sure. learn the game basics through storymode pve, then create a guild of close friends and pvp against other guilds.

Tony Blair · Jan 02, 2007, 08:52 PM // 20:52

The system isn't perfect, no, but it's been this way for 20 months and people have dealt with it. Imagine if you were in Korea, Japan or Taiwan. They don't even have the option to switch to Europe or America. America does get favor and it's not only at ungodly hours as people seem to suggest. It's far from ideal, but this has been an ongoing issue since release and ANet has made no move to change it, so I doubt they will. I wish people still did favor charts to show how often each region has favor.

And I said look at the ladder because:
America/277 Guilds/27.7% of total
Europe/677 Guilds/67.7% of total

At this exact moment Europe has 40% more guilds in the Top 1000. Even if the average European PvPer is better than the average American PvPer, which wouldn't surprise me, it's obvious that Europe has far more PvP players.

Stupid Shizno · Jan 02, 2007, 08:59 PM // 20:59

But that should make sense, there is a larger population in europe then in america.

Bryant Again · Jan 02, 2007, 09:04 PM // 21:04

Exactly, so why has there been a sudden shift in who has favor the most?

jsumners · Jan 02, 2007, 09:10 PM // 21:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Blair

The system isn't perfect, no, but it's been this way for 20 months and people have dealt with it. Imagine if you were in Korea, Japan or Taiwan. They don't even have the option to switch to Europe or America. America does get favor and it's not only at ungodly hours as people seem to suggest. It's far from ideal, but this has been an ongoing issue since release and ANet has made no move to change it, so I doubt they will. I wish people still did favor charts to show how often each region has favor.

And I said look at the ladder because:
America/277 Guilds/27.7% of total
Europe/677 Guilds/67.7% of total

At this exact moment Europe has 40% more guilds in the Top 1000. Even if the average European PvPer is better than the average American PvPer, which wouldn't surprise me, it's obvious that Europe has far more PvP players.

So since the system has been broken for 20 months we should forget about it? We shouldn't bring it to attention (even if it has been brought up before)? That isn't acceptable to me.

Amity and Truth · Jan 02, 2007, 09:24 PM // 21:24

Honestly... this flaw has been discussed to death. I was one of the vivid complainers about it back then. But I seriously gave up on the issue when month after month just passed by with no change to the system and not even acknowledgement of the flaw within.

It's meant to stay.

So my opinion is still:
Remove the connection of PVE and PVP in regards when it comes to dependance. The PVPers got their dependance removed (skill acquisition) but the PVErs still suffer from that connection. But I also want to note that this discussion is utterly futile.

Senator Tom · Jan 02, 2007, 09:26 PM // 21:26

The people who whine about america not having favor just need to go learn to pvp and take halls for themselves, its really not that hard.

log1k · Jan 02, 2007, 09:34 PM // 21:34

I saw Gaile in Kamadan ID1 one week ago and while she was avoiding direct answers as usual, I told her "Not that I care, but you should rethink the favor system"

That caught her eyes. It was 3 AM EST and America had favor. She was like, WOW, it's 3 AM and America has favor!! What's wrong with it? The WHOLE discrict tried to make her understand that this is the time we GET favor, AT NIGHT. No luck, she didnt care at all. She had her idea, and no arguments could make her open up her eyes.

Besides, SO many players LEFT HA because of stupid ANET decisions and changes that it's not competitive anymore, so the region with the biggest userbase online gets it and holds it.

Titan Chrae · Jan 02, 2007, 09:41 PM // 21:41

Now I have not had the same problem JS has had in not being able to access content...but many people have and it is unfortunate. People telling him to get off his butt and win HoH haven't got a clue. This is NOT a PvP ONLY game and that is his point. It is both PvP AND PvE game. The PvE community is very vibrant...So much so that ANET changed the focus of their original PvP oriented concept to cater to PvE players.

I originally thought the favor system sounded cool. But let's face it.. the favor system is a failure. It should be discontinued and locked content should be open to all. The same goes for the Elite missions in Factions (Even though that is strictly PvE). ANET all but admitted that locking content was a catastrophic decision but they are still making mistakes on a lessor scale (Sunspear points anyone?)

Hopefully the next chapter will do away with locked content all together. I have a feeling that will happen in chapter 4 but that doesnt change the fact it's still broke in Prophecies and Factions and to a lesser extent Nightfall. This needs to be a retroactive change.

As far as the Favor System goes... ANET needs to untie the two communities so that they can each enjoy the damn game without destroying play value for the other. Yes...it affectas PvE players now...but what if it the tables where turned? How would PvP players feel if every time an Elite Mission was completed in PvE it gave a moral boost to that districts PvP players? I thought so!